Buying a new car instead of purchasing a used one is almost justified, if one takes a close look at the numbers.

The average new-car payment is now $712. That, of course, is due at least in part to demand being higher than supply. It’s not that Americans are buying fewer new cars than they used to, with sales having peaked at 17.4 million in 2016 and hovering around there until the Covid pandemic hit. It’s that they can’t.

The chip shortage and chronic supply chain issues mean that when it comes to the desire to purchase a new car post-pandemic, it’s about how willing people are to buy what’s available, while possibly paying over the asking price.

The average cost of buying a new car in May 2022 was $47,148, or about the same as a Kia Telluride SX with all-wheel drive and the Towing Package. Conversely, high demand for new cars means the same for used cars.

You might think you’ll get a better deal with a used car, but you likely won’t. Look for a used Kia Telluride and you’ll find that they’re consistently selling for more than MSRP. That’s the case with most models released just before 2020 or after. The Telluride, with its numerous accolades, is the most prominent victim of demand.

But keep looking, and you’ll see that any redesigned Honda Civic, any Mazda CX-30, virtually any car released this decade will be asking for more as a lightly used car. You may soon realize it may make more sense to buy a new one with no miles put on it.

Just don’t spend more than $47,000. I’ll be mad at you.

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There was a golden age of the used car. Maybe 1985 to 1995 when they figured out how to weld galvanized metal and they had perfected things like fuel injection. Used cars were priced like they were 1978 rust buckets but had in fact had dramatically improved.

The market soon caught up and used cars started selling for the percentage of useful life left in them. If a car was 40% used up it would sell for 40% off MSRP.

I’ve been telling people who were set on “gently used” for years they should compare it to the price new. And literally all of them have said the same thing – it’s not worth it. You’re certainly not getting a deal.

Yes you are better off with new but you might have to order and wait as I did with my hybrid Maverick. Also true about the durability of vehicles but I would add 1996 thru 2013 after that the electronics increased and the complexity has led to a decline in reliability and longevity.

I’m going to take a shot every time you mention your Maverick

Try to buy one and then you will understand. If I bought Maverick I would be proud too.

Yes you feel like you won the lottery when it finally comes in after waiting 8 1/2 months. There are some who ordered their Mavericks before me that still haven’t gotten theirs. There are very few Mavericks at the dealers and they were marked up 5k to 10k above MSRP.

Personally I can’t get enough feedback from @JeffS on his Maverick. Am waiting not only for further updates but also for TTAC to publish a full review, from an owner’s perspective.

Since I still can’t get one of my own, I feel like a proud uncle watching/reading about a favourite niece/nephew.

He’s happy about his new truck.

I’m still waiting for mine. Delivery has been delayed for 2 weeks due to a shortage of truck drivers. The car dealership says they have 3 shipments collecting dust in a rail yard in Vancouver. They are trying to get GM to release the vehicles and will hire their own freight company.

@Arthur–I am in the process of moving. I will say that the Maverick rides more like a compact crossover and less like a truck because of the unibody construction. It is front wheel drive and for most who live in an area with snow it will easily get you safely on most roads. Having owned 5 pickups prior to the Maverick and one 4 wheel drive in which I used the 4 wheel drive 5 times in 12 years so for the most part I do not go off road. For Lou and those who go off road frequently there are better choices so the Maverick and the Santa Cruz would not be for them. I just retired and preparing to move into a smaller place with no maintenance so I do not need a large bed or a larger truck but I wanted something with an open bed that was inexpensive to buy and to operate.

A few things about the Maverick are that it sits lower for those who want a pickup that is easy to get in and out of and that is easy to reach in the bed. I installed running boards or side steps on my Isuzu for my wife because it was hard for her to get into and even with the side steps she had problems getting in and out of the Isuzu because of problems with her knees and legs. I had a 2 wheel drive Ford Ranger for about a year and it was still too tall for my wife to get in. Also the Ranger was not anymore efficient than the 4 x 4 crew cab Isuzu with the 3.7 I-5 and not as efficient as my 99 extended cab S-10 with a 5 speed manual and a 2.2 I-4. My wife had no problems getting in and out of the S-10 and no problems driving it except for with health issues the clutch was getting harder for her to use.

There is some engine noise but no more than a Honda Civic or Toyota Corolla but then the Maverick was meant to be inexpensive and compact. If you are not use to a hybrid it takes getting use to not hearing an engine when you start it. When you back up the engine is not running and it beeps. There are no gears in the hybrid so you do not feel shifts which some will not like but it is effortless and quiet. It has a dial between the console to shift which takes getting use to but it does take up less space. Using the dial you do not feel a mechanical shift like you do with a column or most console shifts because it is electrical.

The seats are decent and there is plenty of headroom. Even with the driver’s seat completely back there is plenty of legroom for me and I am 6 feet. There is an indentation is the back of the front seats to give the rear passengers some more legroom. There is storage under the rear seats accessible by lifting the bottom of the seat up and you can also fold the back of the rear seat down and use the inside back of the front for laying things flat. The bed has groves in it to put 2 by 4s width wise to lay drywall or plywood flat. You can also adjust the tailgate to a 45 degree angle if you have a longer load and want to keep it from falling out the back of the truck. There is also an access panel with electrical wiring in the bed to run accessories off of.

My Maverick is the mid trim level the XLT which comes with the navy and gray cloth seats and the dash and doors are trimmed in orange with USB outlets and regular outlets and 2 cup holders in the center and indentations in the front doors for larger water bottles. The XLT comes with cruise control, intermittent wipers, power mirrors, vanity mirrors both driver and front passenger, and alloy wheels which the base XL does not and the base comes with black cloth seats. For about an additional $2,300 you get those additional items that are not available on the base XL and are not even offered as options. The Lariat is the top trim and offers wireless cellphone charging, vinyl interior with a leather like feeling and look, Sirius radio, and a few other things. I ordered a spray in bed line, all weather front and back floor trays, and a full size spare otherwise no extra options. I did buy the side window deflectors and front and rear mudflaps from Ford which I installed myself and there are many Ford accessories to choose from for the Maverick. Overall I am very pleased with my Maverick and it is better than I expected. If you decide to get one be prepared to wait and be patient it is worth it. Do not order too many extras that require chips because you will have to wait even longer as some of those who ordered before me are still waiting for their Mavericks because they ordered all the extras. Ordering for the 2022 MY is closed but orders for the 2023 MY opens August 15. The Ford website to configure your Maverick is easy to use and gives you the price as well.

I’m increasingly thinking I’m going to arbitrage that waiting period once we get back from this summer’s road trip in mid-July. I’ll sell the Highlander for cash at today’s inflated price and then go and get on the list for a new car at MSRP, for delivery in the fall. As long as it’s not road-trip season, we can live with the Bolt and my e-bike for however long it takes the new car to deliver.

I used to be a believer in people holding back when prices spike on stuff they want and people behaving like reasonable, thrifty sentient beings. I thought we were a nation of value buyers on expensive purchases. I thought we bought online because it was cheaper and thought we shopped at Target and Trader Joe’s and Kohl’s because they brought the value.

you keep using the word “value” but I’m sure you don’t have a clue what it means.

Yawn. I see the poors have spent their stimulus and are back to complaining about prices.

Only idiots buy new. I have read it here for over a decade.

Coincidentally, I was thinking of the Telluride yesterday (Kia makes some fine automobiles — ok they make the Telluride, although this morning I checked the fuel economy ratings on the Telluride and I’ve got some hesitation).

Anyway, went out to the driveway to fire up my ancient piece of crap (according to some) and can you believe that the birds had crapped on my car? My car!! So instantly my thought was: “You know, I bet if I had a nice new shiny Kia Telluride in the driveway instead of this old thing, I bet the birds wouldn’t crap on it and people would respect me and it would never need maintenance and probably not even fuel and I could finally live with myself.” And then I thought again and determined that I am full of crap and my cars are Just Fine and my Major Problems and Life Challenges probably lie Elsewhere.

And if I thought some more I would probably think: “You know, if I were Very Wealthy like Art Vandelay, one thing is for sure — I would never fly commercial again.” Because crapping in those tiny little airplane restrooms on a commercial aircraft is not a great experience. I mean, that’s even crappier than riding the bus, or the subway, usually. Because I’ve never seen crap on the subway although Art Vandelay found some — and reported on it.

And I do apologize for this crappy comment. :-)

You’d be surprised how bearable Delta One makes a long flight though. I do try to crap prior to however on long haul flights though. And the crap on the subway is likely a NYC/Atlanta thing.. Can’t say that Ive seen it elsewhere (though if LA had a subway I’m sure it would make the list given the sidewalks). The ones in Tokyo were quite clean. I don’t really do mass transit outside of the world’s mega cities though and I personally daily a 20 year old car nowadays. I didn’t want to pay a grand to decrypt my ECU to tune for a cam. The LS1 has no such nonsense.

“Kia makes some fine automobiles”

How far in the future do you hail from?

“How far in the future do you hail from?”

Haven’t checked the calendar lately, but Dwayne ‘The Rock’ Johnson is President, and interest rates just slid back below 18%.

That would make me actually get off my a$s and find someone, anyone, in Switzerland to offer me a job so that I could secure a short-term residency permit there.

I think this is sarcasm?

I used to only buy used. Then sometime around 2010 I found it cheaper, since I was financing, to buy new. Mainly because 2 – 3 year old low mileage cars plus the difference in interest rates were MORE than a similarly equipped brand new car. That has been the case over the last several purchases. I don’t know if that’s still the case. It might be quite opposite in that used cars are much more than new cars after financing.

If I had $712 here’s what I would buy:

– New transmission oil cooler lines for my daughter’s 2010 Liberty – because not all transmission leaks are due to seals (let’s be grateful for that). Plus transmission fluid/filter/gasket. Plus two transmission speed sensors because of the hiccup (4 almost to 3 back to 4) at highway speeds. Plus two shiny new TYC headlights, and parking lights, and side marker lamps, because she’s my daughter.

– Exhaust gasket material for a Ford Escape (because I wanted to try cutting my own and I can use it next time around with no lead time to order a specific gasket). Plus rear glass struts because I notice things.

– Touchup paint for a Pontiac G6 (except we already had it on hand because my son’s Malibu is the same color). Plus a replacement vanity mirror and new trunk struts.

– New window regulator/motor for the Cadillac (that one came out of nowhere).

Wait a minute, I *did* buy those things — in the past week. And I don’t own a Ford. Nor a Pontiac. What’s THAT about??

I had looked at a 3 used diesel crewcab ZR2’S. They were 2019 models. One had 90,000 km and the other two were surprisingly low mileage around 26,000 km. All three listed for over $57,000. The new one I found has a MSRP of $55,400. Used trucks similar in age to my 2010 F150 have been listing between $12k – $22k. The lower price end ones are beat to death.

Wait, they actually built as many as 3 diesel ZR2s??

@dal20402 – The diesel ZR2 has become a hot commodity with fuel at 2.18/litre even with their being a 10c/litre premium on diesel fuel. The ZR2 diesel gets considerably better fuel economy than the V6. The V6 is rated around 14 city/18 highway (US) whereas the diesel is around 20 city/30 highway (US).

The only place the V6 has any advantage over the diesel is in high RPM applications like desert running or freeway passing. I didn’t like the low torque high RPM nature of the V6. It’s a gutless wonder at low RPM and the transmission doesn’t have a good reputation. Most blame the transmission for the way the powertrain behaves but some point out a lot of the blame lies with the V6. The diesel/6 speed is more reliable than the V6/8 speed.

I’ll believe that claim about reliability when I see it. Euro 5 and up diesels have not exactly distinguished themselves in that area.

I can understand the appeal of the fuel savings in this price environment, though.

Finally! Kia beats Toyota. I waited for this world changing event 40 years.

I’m curious what effect soaring interest rates will have on the car market.

The housing market is cooling off a bit, and I suspect higher interest rates will chill the used market first, since used cars always command a higher interest rate. That could bring prices down a little.

But both new and used may see demand dry up a bit if people can’t afford other living expenses, such as houses, gas, and food. Then you have a recession.

But tight new-car inventory may keep the prices high on used for quite a while.

I’m just glad I got MSRP/0%/48 on my new car in March. Those offers won’t be around much longer.

On another note, I’m seeing more “reduced” prices on cars.com that are still higher than MSRP, which means some dealers are scaling back their markups.

Lastly, I’m shocked anymore when I see a car carrier loaded with new stuff (not Carvana deliveries) – it gives me hope.

I too hope this current economy resets the crazy car market. I’m getting a Santa Cruz as soon as I can find one at MSRP, because there is no way I’m paying over for Hyundai. However since supply is tight even MSRP can be difficult. People are ordering vehicles and waiting months for them to arrive. Due to lack of patients (thanks Amazon Prime) people are will paying more for used cars since they can drive one home today and impress the neighbors with their “new” car. If you have a 2 to 4 year car it is likely worth as much or MORE then you bought it for… that is unheard of.

“If you have a 2 to 4 year car it is likely worth as much or MORE then you bought it for” That’s exactly why I bought my leased 2020 Equinox, with 3 months left on a 3 year 30k mile lease I have only 19,200 miles on it, garage kept still looks new, turning it in was a no brainer since its value is worth much more than the end of lease pay off! I won’t have the 3 year bumper to bumper warranty however the dealer does offer in writing a “lifetime power train warranty” for what ever that’s worth. ;-)

Congrats. Anyone who has a lease ending today should be doing exactly what you did. It’s probably a windfall of several thousand dollars.

I lease, and invariably part of the pitch for doing so is “if the car’s worth more than the buyout, it’s your money”. I always rolled my eyes at that one. Glad it worked for you!

What is all of this doing to leasing? Has the equation changed on that? If you’re paying for depreciation, and there isn’t much, I’m wondering if leasing has been taken off of the table for some carmakers. I made $500 on the cursed VW after 16 months and 19,000 miles. So what would a 2 year lease cost now? On the local news, I’m not seeing the lease specials advertised as much.

Leasing has been taken off for some models such as the Maverick. I think with a vehicle shortage the manufactures are selling everything they make so there is no need to offer leases.

I would think that since leasing is a function of residual value, and residual value is clearly going up, the impact might be positive.

Then again, we also have the offsetting factors of higher interest rates and fewer discounts.

My guess? It’s a wash.

I still can’t figure out why anyone would buy a Kia Telluride and then think it’s a “cool” choice.

Because the Internet commenters say the Kia Telluride is the greatest thing, the coolest thing. Although saying any CUV is “cool” is like saying the nun who teaches Theological Studies in the convent is the hottest.

Because it is hip to buy a suv. Not everyone is hip but enough are to follow the latest fad.

From the Damning With Faint Praise Department: a Telluride is certainly cooler than a lot of other stuff in it’s class.

I bought my 2016 Highlander Hybrid in April 2019. At the time it had 43K miles, a complete dealer service record, and was on the high end of “Very Good” condition. I paid $36k for it which was roughly Blue Book retail given condition and options.

I then watched over the next year or so as its value dropped like a rock to about $25k, reaching a nadir in spring 2020.

Now here were are in June 2022, with the car now having 65k miles and being in slightly rougher (probably the high end of “Good”) condition. Carmax will give me $30k for it immediately, meaning I could probably get more elsewhere.

The current car market is a very odd place to be.

Try Carvana they will give you more and pick it up as well.

I paid $21,500 for a new 2016 Focus ST… drove it for 45k and traded it in for $19,500 this past March. My new car payment is $217 for 36 months.

Back in mid 2019, that trade-in value was hovering around $14k. Car was paid off and I was happy to keep driving the thing for another 6 or 7 years to maximize my money spent on it.

What did you get, and how was the deal on it?

The current used car market has convinced me to not be on the used car market, at least until the recession hits. Better to just sit on the cash unless I really need something. The old Taco isn’t likely to give up the ghost in the next couple years.

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